Episode 9

From Burden to Bliss: Conquering Emotional Trauma

10 9

From Burden to Bliss: Conquering Emotional Trauma

Show Notes

🧠 Episode Summary

Barb Varcl Smith returns for a deep, raw, and radically hopeful conversation with Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna. They dig into how trauma gets stored in the body—and what it actually takes to release it. Barb breaks down myths about trauma recovery, the lies we believe about suffering, and how chronic pain may be your body screaming for help. From childhood wounds to adult survival patterns, this episode offers a sharp and compassionate reminder: you’re not broken. You’re carrying something heavy. And you can finally set it down.

 Trauma doesn’t just live in your memories. It lives in your body. In this fiercely honest conversation, Elaine welcomes back trauma recovery specialist Barb Varcl Smith to unpack:

💥 What We Talk About:

  • The myth of "managing" trauma vs. releasing it
  • What trauma really is (hint: not just the event, but your response)
  • How trauma shows up in the body—pain, illness, patterns
  • Why you might be attached to your trauma
  • The grief of losing a survival identity
  • What to expect from a trauma-release process
  • Why some trauma resolves quickly and some doesn’t
  • Generational patterns, people-pleasing, and control
  • Listening as an act of healing (especially in families)
  • How to create space in relationships (kitchens, garages, beds!)

📞 If You’re in Crisis:

If you're in North America, text 988 for free, 24/7 support.

Elsewhere? Please reach out to your local suicide prevention or mental health hotline. #YouMatter.

💬 Subscribe, rate, and share if this episode moved you. It could be the lifeline someone else didn’t know they needed. #ConverSAVEtions

Bio

Barb Varcl Smith is a therapist, educator, and trauma specialist with over 30 years of experience in human behaviour and emotional wellness. She is dedicated to helping individuals heal from CPTSD, overcome emotional trauma, and break free from generational cycles of pain.

Barb’s work is rooted in a trauma-informed, neuroscience-backed approach that empowers individuals to recognize patterns, process past experiences, and build emotional resilience.

She specializes in working with men, women, and young adults, providing compassionate support and practical strategies for lasting recovery.

Her programs Trauma Response Reprogramming, Your Steps of Ascendance and Complex PTSD Blueprint helping individuals, groups and other mental health professionals change understand of trauma and bring powerful change to life without trauma.

Links & Socials


Suicide Zen Forgiveness Stories re Suicide Loss | Ideation | Mental Health | Offering Hope |Empathy for All website

©2025-2018 Elaine Lindsay SZF42.com All rights reserved.

https://suicide-zen-forgiveness.captivate.fm/episode/from-burden-to-bliss-conquering-emotional-trauma

Elaine Lindsay

Explicit

Transcript
Speaker:

24-7-365 Theme: Shifted, break the shame.

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Check, say their name,

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lifelines Let

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Love

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Day.

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Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna: Hello there.

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It's great to be back.

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I'm Elaine Lindsay.

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This is Suicide Zen Forgiveness, and I

am so happy to be here with you today.

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I am bringing on a

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returning guest, Barb Varcl Smith.

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Hello there.

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Barb Varcl Smith: Hello, Elaine.

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Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna: It's

lovely to have Barb with us again.

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She has a topic that I believe.

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I said before we came on, I have a

feeling this is going to stretch out

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into a number of different sessions

because the topic to me is so vast.

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We are actually talking about, I'm

gonna put it in layman's terms,

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but releasing the trauma that

our bodies carry and which is.

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It's such a vast topic.

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It depends on who you are.

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It depends on your background.

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There are so many different traumas.

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Some of us have , some of us have few.

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Some of us have many.

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And , I honestly, I don't think there's

anybody who doesn't have something.

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By the human condition, you

are going to have something.

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, I think that's the way life goes.

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With that in mind, it's such a.

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Such a deep topic.

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There's so much information.

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That's why I wanted to bring Barb back.

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So Barb, we're gonna let you give

everybody a little refresher on

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who you are and what you do, and

then we'll get into ways you do it.

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Barb Varcl Smith: I'm Barbara Smith.

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I am a trauma recovery specialist.

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And, what I'm doing.

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Is that I'm helping people to.

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Not manage the trauma, but

actually get out of it.

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Like somebody, people call

it like, you can cure trauma.

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And so yeah, I can, but actually

not me, but you, I can help

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you to cure your trauma.

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That's what I do.

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Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna: That is such

an important distinction, and thank

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you for starting there because , that's

something that bears repeating.

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I think people have to understand

our traumas are ours , and the

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choice has to be ours to change that.

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Am I right?

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Barb Varcl Smith: Oh, absolutely.

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Because we cannot force the change.

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We cannot force, , the release.

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We cannot make people recover.

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People have to want, to work on that.

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But a lot of people believe on that

first myth that it's not possible.

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That's not true.

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It's absolutely possible.

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The second method is that

it's take very long time.

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Again, if you use the right tools

, and you really understand how it's

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created, then we reverse engineering

how we can release it and how we

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can recover to fully, so it doesn't

have to take a very long time.

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It can go quite quickly.

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And the third thing is that, as you said,

people not even aware that what they

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experiencing as the adults are actually

result of that trauma because of trauma.

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It's not what happened to us.

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How we reacted to it.

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Yeah.

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So people can be in the same situation

and one would develop trauma and I

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dunno, it's not about what happened,

but how we actually managed to process

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that.

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Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna: I think in

the show notes I'm gonna make a note

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of these things that, that we've hit on

because I think they really are critical.

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And, something you just said, I know that

I've talked about with other people, you

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can, for instance, if the whole family is

in a motor vehicle accident, it doesn't

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necessarily affect everybody the same way.

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Barb Varcl Smith: No.

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No.

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Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna: Is

that a more recent finding?

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Barb Varcl Smith: Oh, I don't actually

think that it's a recent finding, but I

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think this is more, more known now that,

we always knew and even old wisdom saying,

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that we all reacting from where we are

in our life from our present moment.

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So our reactions created by complexity of.

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What we experience in our life, how

we learn from it, what, , our mind

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choose to use, how much emotion we

stress, how we learn to deal with that.

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Even if it's the five people in the same

car of the accident, each of them, it's

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completely different mindset, , from

that mindset, from that set of beliefs,

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from that their experiences, from what

level emotions they already gather

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for somebody, it be tipping point.

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What is, result of it?

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Like you can have the parents who

lost the child in it, or child

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who lost parents , people felt

guilty because they was driver and

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that somebody hurt and,

even in same situation, we

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actually all are in own cinema.

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We are living our own life and we cannot

really see do other people,, cinemas

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we're kind multiple by one person.

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Yeah.

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Same situation doesn't necessarily

mean the same reaction to that.

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Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna: Yeah.

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And I think that's too, in cases

where there's been a fire or there's

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been, something in a public place.

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A lot of people will deal with

survivor's guilt, because , they did

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not lose their lives or they were

not injured, and that too can show up

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very differently for different people.

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Barb Varcl Smith: Yeah, , it's different

for everybody and not that, just those

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who survive, like we see quite often

also trauma of the first responders.

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If it's the fireman, yeah, the EMTs

because, guilt of not able to raise

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somebody or, , sometimes almost opposite

girl that they saw somebody and sometimes

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meantime happen to their family.

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Guilt about what is

more important in life?

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It's real living in

very complicated world.

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And if you look on all different

really sources of trauma,

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we can speak about divorce.

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So that's, now we have one from one.

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Is it like we seeing every other

marriage ending with divorce?

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We could see, , we could see the

children of the military, servicemen.

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So all parents bereavement for any reason.

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So accidents, , or people who

was, with violent, victims

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of the violent crimes we can.

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See poverty that's a big trauma source.

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Or we can see issue with the ill parents,

ill siblings, moving often moving the

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countrys, wars, political situation.

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That's so many things, but there

are still these external factors.

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But we have these also very.

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Family, internal factors of people passing

on their own trauma on their children.

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Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna: Yeah,

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Barb Varcl Smith: because they grew

up in, in trauma, didn't process it.

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And their actions and reactions,

passing that on their children.

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So currently when we looking

on some statistic, are we

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speaking about over 80% of people

suffering from the childhood home?

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Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna: That's a really

good point because my, my mother I thought

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I had a wonderful childhood until in,

in hindsight, there were certain things.

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My mother was incredibly nervous.

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She had to be sedated to get an

eye test just horrific nerves.

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She was a child during the war.

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In kindergarten and grade one, she

had to wear a gas mask to school.

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That's gotta be traumatizing for a child.

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But when we came to Canada, we brought

my aunt and my grandmother with us.

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And for the first few years

we all lived in one city.

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We we all lived in one house.

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And when my father was transferred

after joining the Canadian forces.

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They didn't go with us.

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They stayed here in Ottawa

and we went five hours away.

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It became the telephone was something

to be feared and I didn't think

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on that until I was an adult.

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But if the phone rings after seven

o'clock at night to this day.

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Part of me panics because I'm

expecting it to be bad news and

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my mother would actually ha have a

panic attack when the phone rang.

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Granted, 90% of the time it was bad news.

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We had to get in the car and

drive for five hours to get

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to my aunt, who was very ill.

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But it's that kind of.

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Ongoing suspense, even that I

don't have to be in my own house.

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I can be in a hotel room and if the

phone rings I get that weird feeling.

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So there's a lot of things that we

probably don't think of as traumatic

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at first, but they really can be.

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Barb Varcl Smith: It can be like I can

say for example of one client I work with

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and she has get always almost panic attack

when somebody will start facing next

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to her who just somebody just thinking

and start facing a partner holding

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something and she would get running.

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I didn't know why.

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What did this, where

is really coming from?

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Until we look at that, and that's the

advantage of what I'm doing and you

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can go and find these memories which

are actually causing this panic attack.

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So it came very clearly situation

when she was in very traumatic

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situation and there was a person.

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Pac and for her it was just

that almost like feeling of

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horror or feeling so much fear.

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Yeah.

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Then that the her, that if somebody

was s facing, she didn't remember that

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memory consciously, but subconsciously

was so filled in the fear that it's but

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after we release it, find it, release it.

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Her partner can face him next

to her and she's nothing.

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She's ignoring it.

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Oh,

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Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna: wow.

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Barb Varcl Smith: Doing her anything,

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Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna: Yeah.

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Yeah.

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I suppose once, once you understand,

you know what, what caused this I

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initial issue, you can deal with it,

which makes a great deal of sense.

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And so that's what you do for people, or

that's part of what you do for people.

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Barb Varcl Smith: Yeah, it's part

of it because the one thing is that

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we can sometimes find consciously,

we can like, speak about it and we

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can find, or we think that this is

this we think that this the reason.

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Yeah.

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But as you said that pond ringing

and it's make you feel upset.

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But when we working with subconscious

level, when we go and we will go to

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that moment when it's happened, when

mine will pick up the best kind of scene

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as we call it, to release it, and we

can actually start feeling in the body

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or start feeling that okay, I feel, I

don't know, pressure on the chest, or I

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feel, think my fingers so feeling where

these emotions are really stored in

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the body and then we can release them.

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Phone.

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It's not anymore the trigger.

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It's not doing anything because the reason

why it'll trigger, it's not there anymore.

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So it's why it's really

different from learning or

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trying to understand or managing.

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It's really about get

it out outta our mind.

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Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna: Yeah,

that makes an awful lot of sense.

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Now I have a question.

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Different kinds of trauma.

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Are they stored specifically in

different areas of the body or is

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it more tied to the individual?

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Barb Varcl Smith: Oh, it's tied to

individual, but there are some very

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common things which we can map.

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There is actually several books which

describing, of manifestation on the

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body to the specific types of beliefs

we created for example, illnesses from.

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But it's really about that.

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It's moving through the body.

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Yeah.

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So our emotions first of

course are created in the mind.

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They connected with the mind, even in

this first moment, feel them on the

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body, like goosebumps or something.

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But they're controlled by the mind.

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So we have them in this kind of area.

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It's also reason why first reaction on

things are headaches or feeling nauseous.

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And in that kind of moment we are usually

still able to just naturally process them.

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If we get the rest, get good sleep, have

the nice cup of tea and get the rest,

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we are able to like, get, let it go.

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But if we don't, we start pushing it

down so it gets to the level of the neck.

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Then when we started feeling, or I don't

speak about that, I cannot speak about

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that, or I feel like clocked here, cannot.

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Say, and it is going lower and over

backpack on the shoulders, like

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carrying it as going lower to the

stomach, feeling nauseous, feeling

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anxious, always like feeling that

I'm always feeling unpleasant and it

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starts spreading through the body way.

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So even in that way, we can find where

it in the body, what it's reason.

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And we have actually, if.

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How we speaking about things.

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We speak about that in

that like natural way.

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We would say, this is giving me headache.

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Like there are some situation which is

frustrated and stuff like that, and we

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would say, oh, this is giving me headache.

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Because it's about that we have

that emotion healing, not them.

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And we can actually really level headache

or I cannot take it anymore in the

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way, like I cannot swallow it anymore.

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I cannot, right

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Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna: In a

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Barb Varcl Smith: check language is

even like I cannot eat it anymore.

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And it's really that feeling

of anger and hate it.

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And.

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You will start to have

issues with the gold blood.

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Is it?

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And you cannot stomach it.

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I say that in English

saying I cannot stomach it.

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Yes.

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Yeah.

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Or or I cannot breathe.

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Is it like, oh, I cannot breathe?

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Or or we take somebody, take the breather.

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Just take my breath away.

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The breath away.

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Yeah.

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It's all linked.

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Our we used to speak about

it in, in a more way as it is

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actually what is behind it.

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Yeah.

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So even in the ways of so knees, yeah.

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It's about kneeling.

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Are you feel that you

are nailed by somebody?

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Are you not humble enough to

kneel down and you trying?

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If it's ankles, it's gonna be

about unwillingness or feeling that

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you cannot take a step forward.

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That something like have, like again,

you selling ball on the chain that

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feel like having ball on the chain.

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You cannot move forward.

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We actually naturally describing

that reasons for that feeling

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stored in the boarding?

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Yeah.

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Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna: Oh wow.

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Wow.

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And is there an average number

of sessions you do for like

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different levels of trauma?

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Barb Varcl Smith: Yeah.

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There is, but so if people have,

for example, just I would say,

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I know that systems can slightly

crazy say just about BTSD.

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Yeah.

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If they have like just BTSD, like they

have one event when it's really all

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started, like they car accident or.

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Or something happened.

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One, they can point, almost point it out.

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This was the trigger from that

is going, that's usually like

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one session plus follow up.

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So four weeks of working and they can

be completely out of it if if it's.

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Based in childhood.

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So it's been a longer period of time.

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Then it's usually 12 weeks work.

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It's a three big sessions

and nine small ones.

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So in three months people can be out of

it because that is very important that

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we taking the steps and that is the four

steps we need to take to move forward.

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So over the period of 12

weeks, we do that work.

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Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna: Okay.

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And is there a practice after or are you

really done with it when you're done?

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Barb Varcl Smith: Yeah, because when

we, when you are done and you are done

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because then you learning lay without it.

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So that's starting completely new story

because people find out that people

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will find out that, first of all, often

they don't know who they really are.

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Some people don't even know

what they really like because.

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Colors of clothing was

influenced by their trauma.

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For example, they trying to be

very flushy just to give themselves

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confidence, and then they realized that

they actually like the past colors or

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they was wearing all black and gray

and dark maybe just to hide themselves

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or very visible, and they realize that

they actually love the yellow and red.

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Different, like people will start

doing different sports, hobbies, jobs

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because they also start seeing how

much the trauma influenced their life.

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It's another chapter and sometimes

people saying more like SQL than

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sql.

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Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna:

Yeah, that's true.

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And it, I would assume that.

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However, the length of time they've

been dealing with it is of course

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going to affect how long or how

much work they have to do to undo.

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Barb Varcl Smith: Yeah, that that's true.

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But I would sign that kind of,

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most of people are really

changed after three months.

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People cannot imagine

how intense it is, but.

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In principle, it's about that when we

develop trauma is because our mind use

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some tactic, something which new and what

we learned is how to build that, whether

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we have babies when we were little toddler

or how we supposed to react to things.

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So that what we can do was quite limited

and was very influenced about what

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we saw, like how our parents reacted.

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But when we give the mind another better

way how to deal with that, mind can

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jump on it and just wow, yeah, this I

want, and then just apply it backwards.

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So very important in understanding

of trauma recovery in kind of this

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way is we not, we don't need to

go and process like this happened

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and this, and do like sequence.

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We just need to put the pieces

of the mind which get misplayed

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back to the places of the puzzle.

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It all as supposed to be and

everything working as supposed to work.

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So mind just got tool, how to fix it and

then mind minders go and do it itself.

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You don't have to do it very, consciously,

so it's why it actually goes very quickly.

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Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna:

See, I like that.

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I like things.

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That one and done.

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Okay, I'm done with that.

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Yeah.

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Let's move on.

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Let's go.

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It's, I suppose it depends on the person

as well, how eager they are to let go.

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Because I know over, a long time

I knew someone that was, yeah.

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The best way to put it, I think

it's very attached to their trauma.

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And it, it informed everything

they were and everything they did.

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And so detaching from that, I think

it took them a very long time to

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grieve the concept of loss yet again.

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Barb Varcl Smith: Yeah.

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Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna: And

is that something you deal with?

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Barb Varcl Smith: Yeah.

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You are absolutely right that

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being in the role of the victim,

it is giving us excuse for

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many things in life, giving us,

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Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna: yeah,

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Barb Varcl Smith: a feeling

of it's not my fault.

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I not have to deal with that.

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Somebody else should deal with

that, somebody else should care

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for me, or stuff like that.

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So give Bob that.

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Victim mode as we call it, that and

going to that empowering survival

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mode in the way of I am survival.

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I am outta trauma.

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I don't need to be in survival mode.

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I am recover.

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It's stake.

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Do because it's a really changing life.

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It's a stepping, a huge

step outta comfort zone.

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It's creating the new comfort zone.

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It's like big change.

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So it's, for some people, I would

say there is the one aspect, which

366

:

is very important to consider it

our trauma manifesting on our body.

367

:

Our first and most common manifestation

and very profound is pain.

368

:

Pain is something when the

mind desperately trying to

369

:

get our attention to solve it.

370

:

Yeah.

371

:

So we'll start creating, as I said,

headache, neck pain, shoulders, hands,

372

:

bellyache, stomachache, whatever knees

pain two can be developed to complete

373

:

autoimmune disorders as fibromyalgia and.

374

:

Or multiple sclerosis.

375

:

So if it's getting to that level,

when we have really pain when we, the

376

:

body is aching already, then it takes

them more time, but not too much.

377

:

I think that the longest I work

with six months and that was

378

:

severe case of fibromyalgia.

379

:

But result of it, that, that

lady doesn't have anything.

380

:

Or, like I have several ladies

with fibromyalgia, which don't

381

:

have any pain anymore because

they're usually really suppressed.

382

:

I call this like fibromyalgia multiple

sclerosis aroma and stuff like that.

383

:

We call it through group.

384

:

We call it marker.

385

:

Way that we so believe that our value

is defined by what we doing for others,

386

:

that we need to take that pain on.

387

:

That the pain is just part of life.

388

:

We has to suffer to be valued.

389

:

Not as calling our mind

for actually, please stop.

390

:

Then that's hardest to overcome too.

391

:

To find all these layers and change

that mindset to, no, I am important.

392

:

I am the most important person in my life.

393

:

I can actually serve others much better

if I will actually take care of myself.

394

:

Yeah.

395

:

That, that are usually very more

layers, which needs to be cleared out.

396

:

And it's usually in very much in,

in that almost fake positivity.

397

:

Is it like how successful I am or how

caring I'm or that, so that's sometimes

398

:

hard to turn that, that as much you

serve your family, but you suffering,

399

:

like you actually need to say I'm

stopping serving my family so much.

400

:

They need to become responsible.

401

:

Stuff like it.

402

:

So that can take longer to

get to that point that pain

403

:

is not normal part of life.

404

:

Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna: And I can see

how it, it would almost be a transfer

405

:

from the trauma of the victim state to the

trauma of basically complying and putting

406

:

family first, so that you are, you're

still not really dealing with your trauma.

407

:

Barb Varcl Smith: Yeah.

408

:

It's actually more for

example, family first.

409

:

Nothing against be great mothers.

410

:

And if somebody feel it as

the purpose, that's amazing.

411

:

For it.

412

:

If it's the choice, if

it's the real choice.

413

:

And that's sometimes the people

say, I don't have any other

414

:

choice then, and then it's mean.

415

:

It's not really choice is it?

416

:

So if it's coming from expectations, I

have to be like this, I have to do this.

417

:

I have to put my children first.

418

:

I have to, do this all for my husband.

419

:

I have to do all this.

420

:

Instead of saying I can do this and

all other things will not happen, or

421

:

somebody else has to do them, or we

need to share our workload, or children

422

:

need to accept that this will just

not happening or it'll happening.

423

:

If they are able to take care, own things,

then it's completely different and we

424

:

also see them in that relationship.

425

:

Families that, yeah, even if,

for example, that mother feeling

426

:

like hero she's managing it all.

427

:

If all that pain and hoping for

the pity for the pain, when we

428

:

start looking on the relationship.

429

:

Quite often children feel too controlled,

not really learn responsibility, not

430

:

really allowed to express who they're

because the mom doing everything for them

431

:

or commanding them, this needs to be done.

432

:

Partners don't often feel listen to

and her to, they would even say I would

433

:

like to help her, but she actually not.

434

:

Yeah, I would like tension dynamic, she's,

to do it all, it has to be her make.

435

:

So then we kinda realizing that the

trauma is good, people pleasing, which

436

:

is actually from, is originating.

437

:

Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna: Yeah.

438

:

Barb Varcl Smith: It's

actually hurting others also.

439

:

And having them, and it's why

they're in so much in pain.

440

:

Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna: Wow.

441

:

Yeah.

442

:

Yeah.

443

:

And I was thinking when you were talking

about, I was thinking about someone

444

:

who's very much a people pleaser.

445

:

But there seems to, when that gets

to a certain level, there's a, an

446

:

undercurrent of grudging, like they

begrudge those that they're doing for,

447

:

yet they were never asked to do it.

448

:

They just brought it on themselves.

449

:

And that, that becomes a vicious

cycle, that in and of itself.

450

:

Makes its own trauma.

451

:

Barb Varcl Smith: Yeah.

452

:

Yeah.

453

:

That's turning it in the circle because

on one side, and that is almost like

454

:

conflicting beliefs and they creating

this clash of belief that I need

455

:

to help people on the belief like.

456

:

I, they should do it by themselves.

457

:

And then where is the choice going?

458

:

They not respecting me.

459

:

They don't appreciate me,

but I needed attention.

460

:

I want that, appreciation.

461

:

I want that pity.

462

:

So when we not doing things from.

463

:

Our present things from our inner

strength, from our self love,

464

:

from our own wisdom and intuition.

465

:

And we are doing them because it's

expectation of family, society

466

:

or our own, like what we set up.

467

:

Then.

468

:

It's not, and it's not working for

us and we frustrated or grudging or

469

:

jealous, envy or relationship not

working and it's not working for people

470

:

around us because then if we don't

see, and that's probably like one of

471

:

the very critical things about trauma

when we are in the trauma responses.

472

:

We don't really know what are our needs.

473

:

We not focusing on what we need.

474

:

We just surviving, we not choosing,

we grabbing, we just like this

475

:

is available like that, not is it

good for me or is it not good for.

476

:

But when we do recover from trauma,

we realize that there are options.

477

:

There is not like life in the situation.

478

:

Everything we, there are options in job.

479

:

There are options in where there

are options in partner, there are

480

:

options in hobbies, there are options.

481

:

And we choosing what

it's what we really need.

482

:

Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna: Yeah.

483

:

Barb Varcl Smith: And won.

484

:

And when we start seeing what we need,

we become capable of seeing other

485

:

people needs respectively, respect them.

486

:

Quite often people do things for others

because, oh, I know what you need.

487

:

You don't,

488

:

Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna: yeah.

489

:

Yes.

490

:

That's, yeah.

491

:

That's exactly where I wanted to go

with that because I, my spiritual

492

:

advisor back in 2005, 2006, she

used to teach a monthly class.

493

:

And she had to go over this topic

a number of times because people

494

:

didn't get the fact that she was

talking about homeless people.

495

:

And if you go down the street and homeless

people and it makes you uncomfortable, so

496

:

you give them money, you are judging them.

497

:

And quite often you will get

a very bad response because

498

:

people don't like to be judged.

499

:

But if you give someone money for

coffee or lunch, or you take them

500

:

to lunch because it makes you feel

good and for no other reason, they

501

:

can accept that offer of kindness.

502

:

You can accept.

503

:

Doing something for someone without

judging them, and it becomes

504

:

a totally different dynamic.

505

:

But I think the piece that was missing

back then was this trauma piece.

506

:

You have to have dealt with

your trauma first so that you

507

:

can take yourself out of that.

508

:

That sort of, I don't know balancing act.

509

:

I guess I'd call it,

510

:

Barb Varcl Smith: yeah.

511

:

A lot of people approaching other

people in this kind of savior syndrome.

512

:

Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna: Yeah.

513

:

Barb Varcl Smith: Cannot save anybody.

514

:

Yeah, you can pull somebody from the fire.

515

:

That's physically, but you cannot

really save somebody from that.

516

:

You can offer them options and say, when

we speak about homelessness, when we look

517

:

on them, and then people would say some

people actually don't want to get out it.

518

:

Some people that's right.

519

:

Even they get offer accommodation.

520

:

They would not go for it.

521

:

They didn't deal with the reason why

they are on, like what is actually

522

:

that society, for them meaning

or feeling indebted, feeling that

523

:

charity goes or what, whatever the

reason, feeling, of course feeling of

524

:

failure, which everywhere, every time.

525

:

What did this really about?

526

:

Why they are the it's really

about start listening.

527

:

But when we, before we even start speaking

about listening to homeless or colleagues

528

:

and stuff like that, people should study.

529

:

They start listening to their family,

their children and their partners.

530

:

Yeah.

531

:

Because that is where it's starting and

we see it so much and unfortunately it's

532

:

actually, it's quite even still almost.

533

:

Applauded to this kinda dynamic between

parents and children that, it's my

534

:

house and my rules or you do what

I told you, or you need to, report

535

:

me every moment of your day what

you're doing, and stuff like that.

536

:

Or you have to do the chores the way

I told you to do them, or you have to

537

:

do them when I told you to do them.

538

:

That's actually.

539

:

Listen that's dictatorship.

540

:

Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna:

It a control thing.

541

:

Barb Varcl Smith: Some people

will say oh, they don't know.

542

:

That's actually not true.

543

:

Like children, since they are bored,

are able to choose which color they

544

:

prefer and which color they feel

good, which type of clothes they want,

545

:

what material of clothes they want.

546

:

How many parents not allowing their

children to choose their clothes.

547

:

Yeah.

548

:

Or comments on it or oh, you can

add this ugly, no, if they enjoy it.

549

:

Like why are you judging them?

550

:

Or food?

551

:

That's the big topic.

552

:

And again, you don't understand

how important it's oh, you

553

:

have to this because I cook

554

:

the maybe have the issue with that.

555

:

They have the, they could have

digestive issue with that.

556

:

They could have sensory issue with that.

557

:

Stuff like that.

558

:

Instead of no, you will be

hungry if you wanna eat it.

559

:

Like it's about trial or finding,

finding the right whiteness.

560

:

Maybe they will eat it when it's

separated, not when it's combined.

561

:

Like there is so many respect to it.

562

:

And I remember one example of mine do

you know Brussels sprouts from Scotland?

563

:

For sure.

564

:

Know brussel sprout.

565

:

Yeah.

566

:

You love them.

567

:

You love them.

568

:

Yeah.

569

:

And Brussels is exactly the vegetables.

570

:

You love them or you hate them.

571

:

Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna: You ate them.

572

:

Yeah.

573

:

Barb Varcl Smith: And the reason

is that the taste, the specific

574

:

taste for brass sprouts actually

coming from sour, which is in Yes.

575

:

Yeah.

576

:

And since I was little, everybody else

in my family could have bruss sprouts

577

:

and was very common, have the, even

like buying the mixture for the soup.

578

:

But rose be pieces, few

bas of sprouts in it.

579

:

I cannot stomach it.

580

:

I wasn't able to eat it.

581

:

I always, flip it out.

582

:

School.

583

:

I was, oh, you have to die.

584

:

I was like, no, I'll just not eat it.

585

:

I cannot eat it.

586

:

I hate it so much.

587

:

24-7-365 Theme: Yeah.

588

:

Barb Varcl Smith: And luckily I had

the parents who accept it, they said

589

:

okay, if you, it's vegetable you

don't want to eat, don't eat it.

590

:

That fine.

591

:

Later on, I actually find out

that I as person actually have

592

:

really trouble with the sulfur.

593

:

I cannot digest the su, so like

my body knew that since I was,

594

:

that I just cannot digest it.

595

:

Children don't want to eat something.

596

:

It's not question to be picky always.

597

:

It's about finding the way, and it's

also, it's changing with the time.

598

:

It's, some people cannot make mistakes.

599

:

Some people are, it's hot.

600

:

Actually some people cannot have

garlic or onions because they can.

601

:

We are so reliable,

wide variety of people.

602

:

So when we start listening home

to basic things, of colors,

603

:

of clothes, of materials, of

604

:

24-7-365 Theme: food,

605

:

Barb Varcl Smith: of time when

we sleeping, what we like to

606

:

do as a hobby, very tough.

607

:

Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna: And I'm, I

prime example of the bad mother because

608

:

I wanted my children to look a certain

way and they would, I wanted them

609

:

to wear what I wanted them to wear.

610

:

And my, my son my, my son is is me

in miniature only more stubborn.

611

:

He he had a problem with suspensions, and

they would give antibiotics to children.

612

:

The suspension from penicillin and

613

:

He couldn't, if you put it in

his mouth, you would wear it.

614

:

It didn't matter who you were.

615

:

And he told us that from the

time he was a little kid.

616

:

And you, you only get thrown up on

a few times when you realize, you

617

:

know what, this is not worth it.

618

:

And we ended up I can remember

him being in the hospital and us

619

:

trying to explain to the doctor.

620

:

It's something about the actual

suspension and this doctor

621

:

poo-pooed that and we said, okay.

622

:

And we just walked outta the splash zone.

623

:

And the doctor once, once he

wore the whole suspension, he

624

:

understood what we were telling him.

625

:

But it's, it is interesting.

626

:

If you listen to kids, yes,

they know that you are right.

627

:

They know the colors, they like,

they know the vegetables they want.

628

:

And I will say that my parents, we

were told we had to eat what was on

629

:

the plate, but it was at least try it.

630

:

If you try something once and you're not

going to eat it, okay, you've tried it.

631

:

I had a problem with

eggs when I was a child.

632

:

I couldn't swallow them.

633

:

They would just come right back up and

that it, it became that my parents knew

634

:

there was just no point in doing that.

635

:

I wasn't trying to be obnoxious.

636

:

It was just the way it was and

yeah, it's, it really is about

637

:

listening to your children.

638

:

I, I have to tell you my parents.

639

:

Took the children, my, my two and

my nephew to Scotland and they had

640

:

gone to, I believe it was Lock Lomond

to the castle for this big dinner.

641

:

And through the dinner there was

this carrot and coriander soup.

642

:

My daughter was the oldest child.

643

:

She was 15 at the time, and

not nobody was eating the soup.

644

:

My father said he would give them a pound,

whoever ate the soup, and Amanda just put

645

:

her head down and ate some of the soup.

646

:

My father said he couldn't even

swallow it, but she got the pound.

647

:

24-7-365 Theme: Yeah.

648

:

Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna: But it

is it's it's so different when

649

:

we listen to those around us.

650

:

And the other thing I

think is expectations.

651

:

We have to let go of expectations because

things are different from when I was a

652

:

kid, you were expected to say thank you.

653

:

You were expected to write a note,

you were expected, to go back

654

:

across the street and return the

sugar or, those are just examples.

655

:

It's not the world we live in now and

it's not how children are brought up.

656

:

So being annoyed with the child for not

doing something the parents never taught

657

:

them really doesn't make a lot of sense.

658

:

Barb Varcl Smith: Yeah.

659

:

And another thing is what

causing most issues is actually.

660

:

Not adjusting our expectation

with the partners.

661

:

Yeah, so it's saying even in the

Bible is women will left their

662

:

parents and join the husband.

663

:

Men will left their parents join his

life and they will become feminine.

664

:

It that's forgetting the definition.

665

:

They will be complimented.

666

:

So they need to create their own

ways and we all living and they're

667

:

like, oh, I'm used to doing that way.

668

:

It's how is normal?

669

:

It's supposed to be done this way.

670

:

And they come other person coming

from different and saying no.

671

:

This is supposed to be done this way.

672

:

And that is like this most

common reasons why actually.

673

:

People would end up in divorce or

like pluses or not working because

674

:

they don't, working on these small

things, small, like basic things.

675

:

And I would've the couple coming from for

like relationship counseling and rubal,

676

:

the most of what we ending up about.

677

:

They have trauma process but

most of the time it's coming.

678

:

Okay.

679

:

Sit down and write everything which has

happened in household in whole year, and

680

:

agreed on how it is done, who is doing it,

when it is done, and actually discuss it.

681

:

No it's in my house as white.

682

:

It'll be my way.

683

:

That's not really equal work, is it?

684

:

No, because it's the

partner living there also.

685

:

It's true.

686

:

So very common when we are speaking

about mental health for men also is

687

:

that are not listened to, is that they

keep it in they go into their main case.

688

:

And we always gratify like we made

signs of the man and let them be in

689

:

their garages and stuff like that.

690

:

But we told that often they're there

and they don't want to be there.

691

:

They prefer to home surrounded

by the family, going for family

692

:

actions and stuff like that.

693

:

But there is no any space for

them created in the house.

694

:

Because house or house, there's

no their, there's no their room.

695

:

There is no space for them to be part of

the family because it messy be something.

696

:

So they are almost like, no, you

go there because this is mine.

697

:

And then the women are surprised

that they feel lonely and the

698

:

partners are in interacting with

them and not taking them anymore.

699

:

It's oh, you cuddle, kick him

out from the house to the garage.

700

:

Don't surprised he's

not speaking with you.

701

:

You told go be there.

702

:

I don't wanna speak with you.

703

:

So he just follow your instructions.

704

:

Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna: Then

it gets to the point that why

705

:

would he go anywhere else?

706

:

Yeah, that's such a good point.

707

:

We, early on in our marriage, my,

my husband is not a morning person,

708

:

24-7-365 Theme: not

709

:

Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna: by any stretch

of the imagination and myself and the

710

:

children, we came to understand that

because he's not a morning person.

711

:

Once he's in the kitchen, your

best to stay out of there.

712

:

So it became ritual for us to say

dad, can you make my lunch for school?

713

:

Dad, can you make a coffee?

714

:

Dad, because our kitchen was in the

middle of the house, once you were in

715

:

there, nobody else could come through.

716

:

And so he got to have his place.

717

:

It wasn't in the garage in mornings.

718

:

He got the kitchen all to himself,

719

:

and he still does.

720

:

Yeah.

721

:

But yeah you have to

make room for everybody.

722

:

Everybody has to have their place.

723

:

In a home.

724

:

It's like when you get a dog

or a cat, they have to be

725

:

given space that is theirs.

726

:

You know that's their little place to

go and relax, to not have to be on, if

727

:

you will when everyone else is around.

728

:

It's funny that, that was always

in our house after dinner.

729

:

My father would go into the living

room and he had a beautiful, big,

730

:

lazy boy and a beautiful couch, and

he would lie in the middle of the

731

:

floor right next to the coffee table,

and he would have a half hour sleep.

732

:

That was what he did every single day,

and it was just, that was his place.

733

:

His ritual is whatever and it just.

734

:

He was part of our surroundings.

735

:

He was with us and I guess he did

it because he wanted to be with us.

736

:

And him and my mom were smart enough

to give each other space in a weird

737

:

way because it's really strange when

you have friends over and your father's

738

:

lying in the middle of the floor.

739

:

Barb Varcl Smith: Yeah.

740

:

We are all individuals

and all need the space.

741

:

I had the one couple and they

came and they said we, thinking

742

:

about divorce, they're like, so

she wants to come for therapy.

743

:

I don't really wants to know guide,

she said that I'm set on divorce.

744

:

Okay let's discuss this.

745

:

Like what's happen.

746

:

Okay.

747

:

Both terrible, childhood, so they

would need to work on themselves.

748

:

First question.

749

:

Okay, what is this really about?

750

:

What is it trigger now?

751

:

Like why now?

752

:

Like after you so long

together, what is that?

753

:

The think point of that?

754

:

And she would say, no, Cindy moved.

755

:

He's nothing can speak with me.

756

:

He is like so snappy and

angry about everything.

757

:

It's okay, so what

happened when you moved?

758

:

And I asking him like,

what was that move about?

759

:

He said she decorated

house, all ingrained.

760

:

It's supposed to be modern.

761

:

I cannot stand that house.

762

:

I would rather get divorced

and have to live in that house.

763

:

I cannot stand the gray color.

764

:

It's irritating me.

765

:

I cannot sleep there.

766

:

I cannot dress that.

767

:

So I don't want to be there.

768

:

I'm just for me life.

769

:

Last point.

770

:

And she was like, oh, but it's

a, it's a friend and mother.

771

:

Yeah.

772

:

It's supposed to be your house.

773

:

Scheme, like what you do or if

you, okay, you living in gray and.

774

:

Dining room or something, which can

be in some color, he can like actually

775

:

feel that yeah, he can be there or

his bedroom needs to be great so it's

776

:

gonna be the thing and that's gonna

be the tipping point of feeling.

777

:

I'm not listened to my

opinion, taken in account.

778

:

I, but I have no say right?

779

:

Diminished feeling, not good

enough, not have the right opinion.

780

:

We often thinking about toxic

relationships in this big way.

781

:

We think about like domestic

abuse and men who are aggressive,

782

:

oring, rubal, it's quite 50 50.

783

:

It's not always men,

784

:

Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna: it's no

785

:

Barb Varcl Smith: also women

because actually these behaviors,

786

:

which overuse the word narcissistic

absolutely out, very overused, not.

787

:

In right place are quite

often the results of trauma.

788

:

But people living in trauma bonds

they saying in it because they don't

789

:

believe that they deserve better.

790

:

And these people like not managing

their emotions and actually just

791

:

want to feel good enough and

just want to feel appreciated and

792

:

don't know how else to do that.

793

:

But when we see the men doing it, I

be aggressive with Totally say toxic.

794

:

Toxic masculinity.

795

:

Yeah.

796

:

See woman be verbally aggressive or this

kinda forceful in, how they managing

797

:

the household and stuff like that.

798

:

You all saying like, how great

woman, she's not really, there should

799

:

be still balance on both sides.

800

:

Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna: Yeah.

801

:

It because.

802

:

What you're saying makes so much sense

because it's usually, even think back when

803

:

you were a kid, when you get in these big

fights, it was never over something big.

804

:

It was over some little tiny slights

that probably had very little to

805

:

do with what had actually happened.

806

:

But it seems to be how

humans are inclined.

807

:

We, we often let the big stuff slide.

808

:

It's the little tiny

bits that, what is it?

809

:

The princess and the p?

810

:

Barb Varcl Smith: Yeah,

811

:

Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna: it's the P

that gets them not everything else.

812

:

Wow.

813

:

Barb Varcl Smith: But I would get

people just, I know that we can

814

:

run time and the one kind advise,

everybody can apply if they have

815

:

the partner, any type of partner.

816

:

But actually it's working

also with the children.

817

:

I would say.

818

:

Have the pillow talk in the way.

819

:

Have the talk in that vulnerable space

actually in the bedroom when you know

820

:

that other people don't hearing you.

821

:

When you have this pro close proximity

and actually start with that, I love

822

:

you, or I want to be with you at this

behavior that, let's speak about it.

823

:

Let allow ourselves to cry.

824

:

Let allow ourself actually say what.

825

:

It's as you realize more when you

do it, it's become very natural.

826

:

Yeah.

827

:

15, 20 minutes.

828

:

Just get together, like when you waking

up or when you going to the bed and speak

829

:

about what's happened that day, what's

happening, how you feel, and allow the

830

:

men and encourage each other to speak

about how you feel and say oh, what you

831

:

did, oh, that has to be frustrated for

you, or that has to be like, are you upset

832

:

about it if people cannot express it?

833

:

And also do it with the children.

834

:

It's really like when my son, we call

it like, before go to bed, just talk him

835

:

in the back and speak about how, what,

how do you feel like what's happened.

836

:

You holding all very bravely in

school, let it go out and you will

837

:

develop the relationship will change.

838

:

It will develop really good relationship.

839

:

They have that connection in that

family and can share how they feel.

840

:

They live in hope and grow.

841

:

Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna: That's

so beautiful because the bottom

842

:

line, what you're saying is,

listen, don't fix, just listen.

843

:

Because very often that's

what we're doing wrong.

844

:

We're all so busy trying

to fix everything.

845

:

Teenagers need us to be

there as family support.

846

:

They don't need us to fix everything.

847

:

They just need us to listen

and let them know we are there

848

:

for them and that's, yeah.

849

:

It all has to do with emotional

quotient and having EQ rather than

850

:

IQ, I think is really important.

851

:

And once again, you are absolutely right.

852

:

We're running out of time, however.

853

:

Okay.

854

:

The beauty of this is I'm the

host and I get to invite you back.

855

:

Barb Varcl Smith: I would love to come.

856

:

Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna: Ah,

I think this is wonderful.

857

:

Barb, I thank you so much because

I think every time we talk, you

858

:

are going to be releasing more

layers for people to understand

859

:

and what you shared with us today.

860

:

I think is invaluable.

861

:

Absolutely invaluable.

862

:

While I'm muttering away here, I

wanna make sure that we put up.

863

:

Your address for your URL so that

people know where to get you.

864

:

You will find all the information about

Barb below and we will also have the

865

:

link to the earlier show where Barb

spoke to us at beginning for the first

866

:

time, all about releasing trauma.

867

:

This has been absolutely

fascinating to me.

868

:

Thank you so much.

869

:

I appreciate that.

870

:

For anybody who has

questions, just pop them in.

871

:

Let us know what your questions

are and we'll be able to let

872

:

you know when Barb comes back.

873

:

Thank you so much, Barb.

874

:

I appreciate you being here.

875

:

Barb Varcl Smith: Welcome.

876

:

I'm happy to see you and happy

looking forward to come again.

877

:

Elaine @TheDarkPollyanna: Yay.

878

:

I think that's wonderful.

879

:

To our audience, make the very

most of your today, every day,

880

:

and we'll see you next time.

881

:

Bye for now.

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About the Podcast

Show artwork for Suicide Zen Forgiveness Stories re Suicide Loss | Ideation | Mental Health | Offering Hope |Empathy for All
Suicide Zen Forgiveness Stories re Suicide Loss | Ideation | Mental Health | Offering Hope |Empathy for All
Shattering Stigma Igniting Hope

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About your host

Profile picture for Elaine Lindsay

Elaine Lindsay

A unique blend of finely tuned chaos with a boatload of compassion. An unfiltered speaker, resilience mentor, and podcast host with 50+ years of lived experience navigating suicidal ideation, Pollyanna’s glad game, trauma, chronic illness, and the power of showing up anyway.

Elaine Lindsay🎤 Speaker | Host | Podcaster | 6x Suicide Loss |@TheDarkPollyanna - Opinionated AF
#Youmatter | Let’s start #ConverSAVEtions